help-my loach is crooked and tank needs overhaul

The forum for the very best information on loaches of all types. Come learn from our membership's vast experience!

Moderator: LoachForumModerators

Post Reply
melody
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:10 am

help-my loach is crooked and tank needs overhaul

Post by melody » Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:17 am

:(

I have a fairly new tank going with mollies and one loach. Recently had elevated ammonia, but thought it was under control. Today was 2nd day of treatment for possible ich. I did not realize that quick-cure might harm the loach....oops. His body has become more and more crooked and I don't know why. I read somewhere online that it could be constipation?? I am ready to start over with a 50% water change and get the tank back to good condition. I would love to keep the loach and treat him if necessary. I have really enjoyed him in the tank and don't know enough about him I guess... Has anyone seen a crooked loach, or have any suggestions as to what to do now?

User avatar
Munkee
Posts: 295
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 10:19 pm
Location: Long Island
Contact:

Post by Munkee » Mon Jul 23, 2007 9:00 am

If you could answer a few questions first, it may help to find out what is going on, instead of just tossing ideas out there.

What size is the tank? How long has it been setup? Was it cycled? What are the current water parameters, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

What kind of loach is it?

Is anyone else in the tank ill, or appear to have signs of illness?

Lets see if we can figure this out for you. :D

melody
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:10 am

Post by melody » Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:29 pm

The tank is about 25-28 gallons, curved front. Sorry, that's as close as I recall. It has been set up for almost 2 mos. I had one fish die, and have since realized that I should have sterilized the fish net after removing him. Learning lesson..... Yes, the tank has cycled. The ammonia was too high, and I used ammo-lok product to help, as well as a partial water switch. pH is good, and nitrate and nitrate are both okay too. The fish acted like they were starving, so I am afraid that I am guilty of overfeeding too. Another learning lesson.... I know about the all food eaten w/in 3 minutes rule, but why do they act so darn hungry!?

The loach is a dojo.

Yes, other fish are now acting sickly. I am starting to think that this may be a lost cause, may have to start fresh.... But I do want to know why the loach is crooked. Any thoughts on that constipation idea, or was that a bogus line I got from internet research?? How do loaches respond to possible ich?

Thanks for any feedback, and I promise to be a better tank owner in the future.... :oops:

User avatar
loachmom
Posts: 1627
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 4:13 pm
Location: USA

Post by loachmom » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:39 am

Hi, melody, and welcome to the forum. :D

I have a kuhli loach that was crooked when I bought him. He seems to be straightening out. Not sure why.

I have a thread about him on this page. There are pictures, too.

Crooked Kuhli

Diana
Posts: 4675
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 1:35 am
Location: Near San Franciso

Post by Diana » Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:24 am

Cycle: To grow the nitrifying bacteria that remove Ammonia and Nitrite from the water, and turn it into Nitrate.

If you are having to use Ammo-Lok to deal with Ammonia, your tank is not cycled.

"OK" readings for
Ammonia: 0 ppm in a cycled tank, not higher than .25 ppm in a still cycling tank.
Nitrite: 0 ppm cycled, 1 ppm while still cycling
Nitrate: does not show up in a cycling tank until near the end, a cycled tank should show under 20 ppm.

What are your readings?

If your tank is showing Nitrite add salt at the rate of 1 teaspoon per 20 gallons to reduce the possibility of brown blood disease. This is a very low dose, even Loaches do not mind this small an amount.

Ammonia burns the gills, leading to breathing problems.
Nitrite reacts with the blood so it cannot carry as much Oxygen, so it looks like another breathing problem.
Ich can infest the gills before you even see it on the fish, leading to breathing problems.

Ich falls off the fish and lands on the floor of the tank to reproduce. One portion of the control of Ich is a lot of gravel vacs. The more frequently you vacuum the gravel, the more Ich you are removing before they can reproduce.

During cycling the more water changes you can do the lower the toxins, and the more fallen food and fish poop you remove, the lower the toxins. Do lots of frequent water changes, especially using the gravel vac to pick up debris from the bottom. Feed less. The fish will be more encouraged to search around in the tank to find the fallen food, and will clean up better. (Still, whether it is eaten or not, food = Ammonia, so feed less)
38 tanks, 2 ponds over 4000 liters of water to keep clean and fresh.

Happy fish keeping!

grizzlyone
Posts: 272
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 10:46 pm
Location: Chicago, IL

Post by grizzlyone » Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:56 am

Maybe this should be a sticky. Get a bottle of SeaChems Prime.


Kevin

tattooedgemini
Posts: 94
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 3:26 am
Location: ontario canada

Post by tattooedgemini » Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:46 am

yes, keep up on water changes, but if you do too many you wont be helping, you will be getting rid of all the bacteria that is healthy in the tank...frequent small water changes will be best, i would probable do 10 or 15% every 3 days or so until the problem solves itself..what filtration does your tank have? it needs some kind of bio-filter to keep the water healthy for the fish...you will know if you have ich because your fish will be all spotty, i think they are just upset because the tank is not really cycled...if you go into a pet store you might be able to get them to sell or give you some of their bio-filter media that has already been cycled to help your tank out, or maybe if you have an aquariast friend they might share some with you, just be sure their tank and fish are healthy....to fully cycle a tank takes several weeks to do, and loaches are very sensitive fish so keep a close eye on him.. good luck with your loachy...

User avatar
Tinman
Posts: 1485
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 10:21 pm
Location: Kansas,USA

Post by Tinman » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:13 am

Mollies require salt being a salt water fish that will only survive in fresh. Mollies are the "canary in a coal mine" for starting salt tanks and only flourish in salt water enviroments Loaches detest salt so this combination is not ideal.

Ich treatments can kill your filter so water changes are neccasary to keep ammonia in check during meds and ammonia levels should be checked morn and eve every day during meds and changes made based on results.

Most of the crookedness I have seen comes from poor breeding stock.When my breeders of other specie reached the end of their career the babys became twisted,hump backed or lacked colors

Blue
Posts: 498
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:04 am

Post by Blue » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:41 am

Tinman wrote:Mollies require salt being a salt water fish that will only survive in fresh.
Are these mollies from the well-known genus Poeciliids (unless I did not realize there is another fish called a molly)? Mollies are not saltwater fish. They are rather freshwater that do tolerate brackish to saltwater conditions. They do not require salt unless they have been adapted to brackish or saltwater conditions.

May I know where you got the information that mollies are saltwater fish?
Passion for loaches + Passion for snails = Irony

melody
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:10 am

Post by melody » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:09 am

The mollies and loach were all from Petsmart. The mollies were supposed to be a freshwater, community fish. Maybe there are 2 kinds of "mollies"?? I had never heard of a salt water mollie before. Maybe I am spelling it wrong too, could be molly? Not sure....

Regardless, the tank is now empty of fish. Everyone was dying, it was real sad. I did a 50% water change, and am giving it a few days to stabilize before I start checking the readings again. I do have a little tub of good bacteria that I can add to the tank to help with the filter having been treated for ich. I did remove the filter and rinsed it really well. Of course the tank has been dechlorinated etc.

Guess I will have to start fresh.... Thanks to everyone for your advice and feedback. Everyone little bit helps, especially since I DO want to get this right next time! :) :)

PS I have a bio-wheel filter, to answer one of the questions.

Blue
Posts: 498
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:04 am

Post by Blue » Fri Jul 27, 2007 6:42 am

melody wrote:Maybe there are 2 kinds of "mollies"??
There is more than just two as far as I can remember.
I had never heard of a salt water mollie before. Maybe I am spelling it wrong too, could be molly? Not sure....
There was no saltwater molly. As far as I know, mollies have always been classified under freshwater category although they are very tolerant of brackish and marine conditions.
Passion for loaches + Passion for snails = Irony

User avatar
shari2
Posts: 6224
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 2:17 pm
Location: USA

Post by shari2 » Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:58 am

A page that might help with salt and mollies:
http://www.guppylog.com/story/2004/1/31/5655/54195

And another one:
http://tcoletti.tripod.com/molly_salt_debate.html

here's the dojo loach species guide:
http://www.loaches.com/species-index/we ... licaudatus

There's also a link to misgurnis mizolepis. You should check out both to see which dojo type you have.

When you say 'fairly new' how long has it been set up?
It does sound to me like it may be still cycling. Mollies and dojos have different requirements...dojos prefer cooler water than mollies. What type of molly do you have? Fancy sail fin mollies should be kept at about 80F.

And the wiki on ich:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichthyopht ... ultifiliis
Quick Cure can harm the biofilter and in a newly cycled (or not yet cycled) tank you may have damaged the biofilter further. This explains your ammonia readings.

If the tank is now empty I'd sanitize the whole thing and start from scratch. Boil your substrate or bake it to get rid of any parasites. Dip your plants or get new ones. Wash the tank well and get new filter media (ie your biowheel) or be sure to wash it well in very hot water. A dip into boiled water may be a good idea. Ich will cling to the substrate and the biofilm in your aquarium. Get rid of it entirely before adding new fish.
How did you originally cycle the tank? With fish or fishless cycling?

You may want to read up on cycling a tank:
http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-cycling.html

In any case, sorry for your losses. :cry:
books. gotta love em!
http://www.Apaperbackexchange.com

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 200 guests