i need help--Really lots of it!
Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:32 pm
First, I am not as familar with this board as I could be/should be. So, I am not sure this is the right sectionfor the following. It does involve a clown loach so this seems to be the best one--lol. And, I just looked at the post counts and figured it is the highest traffic area. If it is misplaced--please move it to the proper location.
I ramble a bit in posts--so please persevere.
I have an issue--it is correct, species spefic, information to being delivered to hobbyists by retailers. Information typically provided by retailers that should know better to hobbyists that don't. It is information delivered to Hobbyists that rely on retailers to provide honest, accutrate information about fish they sell.
I wander a number of boards. This being one of the best. I see, like most of us do, the endless threads that get into lfs or mass merchandiser bashing. Over the years I began to tune them out--even avoid them. I always thought if it bugs you that much--do something productive--let's not just complain to ourselves.
I recently stumbled into a couple of those threads elsewhere by accident. I am a long time member at one of the sites where I saw the bashing. I knew the person bashing well enough that I shared a letter I had sent to PetSmart a couple of days earlier. Only the second time in my life I had penned that type of letter--the first time dealing with the fishkeeping hobby.
The response was interesting. Never really expected it. As I said to an on-line friend, had I expected the letter to be anything other than a single "angry man" letter that mass merchandisers receive I would have written it in an entirely different fashion. With an entirely different style. But, since it was a single "angry man" letter it is what was sent.
It turns out that a number of fishkeepers from a number of other sites liked what they saw. And thought they too could do the same. I guess it turns out that fish folk do want better.
Here is that letter.
-----------------------------------------
9/16/06
Mr. Kenneth T. Hall
Sr. Vice President, Merchandising
PetSmart, Inc.
19601 North 27th Avenue
Phoenix, AZ 85027
Dear Mr. Hall,
I visited your website this morning and saw your engaging photo with “George”. That was enough to make me think that you were the individual that this correspondence would be best directed.
I visited one of your locations yesterday. I was looking for an iron supplement for a planted aquarium as well as a water conditioner. While in your store I looked at many of the fish that PetSmart sells. I was generally impressed with the quality of the tanks and the apparent health of the specimens in PetSmart tanks.
I do, however, take serious exception to the blatant misinformation evidenced on the in-store advertising. POP signage. It could be construed as misinformation designed as a cross merchandising technique to sell other product to the fish buyer. Probably simple mistakes.
Let’s take two of the signs; found on the tank to describe the species therein —if you want I would be willing to address many, many more.
Leporinus fasciatus.
In store sign says max length is 7”. This fish grows to nearly 12” (30cm).
POP signage says a 10-gallon tank will suffice. A 12” fish in a 10-gallon tank? Is the staff at PetSmart familiar with what is commonly called “stunting”? A documented anatomical and physiological occurrence resulting in deformities and often times disease and death.
The signage also calls out the requirement for Aquarium Salt. Why? The fish is found in fast moving waters of the Amazon River basin. One of the last areas you will find concentrations of Sodium Chloride remotely approximating what will happen if a fishkeeper follows your directions and adds “Aquarium Salt”. You may find mineral salts, darn few and certainly of a different nature. And, interestingly, the concentrations of the mineral salts found in the natural environment will typically be far exceeded in many of the water supplies across North America. Is Sodium chloride really “required”?
Clown Loach (Botia macracanthus/Cobitis macracanthus)
Another 7” fish if PetSmart is to be believed. And, once again they should not be. Commonly thought of as a 12”+ species this fish has proven to grow much larger in favorable environments.
A 10-gallon tank is called out on the POP signage. Most respected sources say something along the lines of a tank with the minimum of 36” length for smaller specimens (the ones you sell) and substantially larger for older fish.
Thankfully the myth of Aquarium Salt was not perpetuated with this species.
Mr. Hall, I guess my concern is that PetSmart postures itself, in so many ways, as to be interested and concerned for and about the life forms it sells to the public. To see such a blatant disregard for a non-mammal line of livestock is disconcerting.
Your company periodically receives a bashing on-line by the “new” fishkeepers. People that discover so much of what they were doing was not really a good approach to promoting fish health and longevity. A bashing delivered to relieve some of their own internal pressure when discovering that fish deaths can be avoided with appropriate care and housing. Call it “responsible husbandry”.
Does PetSmart engage in providing misleading information by design, or are the incredible number of errors in the information provided just simple mistakes? Maybe an error at the printer? Or, even the result of overzealousness by a copywriter attempting to promote cross merchandising without adequate knowledge of the fish he or she is describing?
I am not an ichthyologist, a chemist, a biologist, or a scientist of any kind. I am just a simple fishkeeper that has managed to do the research (utilizing legitimate scientific resources) to gain an understanding of what I need to do in order to avoid the easy art of killing fish. I am a fishkeeper that believes it incumbent upon retailers of your stature to do the same.
Heck, have John Gerstenberger, or the copywriters, simply go on-line to www.fishbase.org . They will find an amazing amount of scientifically based, species specific, information which may help them understand the fish you sell just a bit better. From there it is rather simple to find the competent PhD’s in the biochemistry and fish fields that will more completely fill out the knowledge base required. The legitimate information is out there with just a few clicks of the mouse. The information at the sites for many of the well recognized and respected Universities in the United States (and internationally) provides a plethora of data that discusses many of the issues you could take a leadership position with as a responsible “Pet” retailer.
Hopefully the next visit to a PetSmart will be less insulting to the senses. And, since I do enjoy PetSmart, hopefully the next visit will not be the last. Or, even the beginning of a different approach to promoting accuracy in information.
Respectfully,
cc. Robert F. Moran
Barbara Fitzgerald
Mary Miller
------------------------------------------
It seems a number of people scattered about the country, members of several other sites, have decided they dislike wrong info and are writing letters (even stealing the one you just read). Don't know that using what I wrote is best. Usually letters like that are best when someone speaks from their hearts, in their own style.
POP signage is such a routine thing. So easy to update--and frequently updated and reprinted anyway.
I just want accurate information about species.
All the stuff with pH Up and Down; Bacteria in a bottle; Aquarium Salts.....is incidental. If consumers start getting basic, accurate, information I will feel like a victory is achieved. The other crap--caveat emptor--in most cases, from my view of the world. Stores have to make money. As long as they do not harm fish with product or lie to a consumer.....
I found the adress and names contained in the letter on the PetSmart website. If you don't want to use snail mail here is an e.mail address.
corpcommunications@ssg.petsmart.com
Hopefully you feel as strongly as many others do and participate in sharing your thoughts about misleading in-store signage.
thanks for reading.
sully
___________
oh, to the folks i have shared threads or chats with in the past, if you feel a perverse need to see the originating thread it is over at that site several others here periodically stop by--or I think of as home..
and, i don't keep up as well as I should with the genus and species thing. So confused by the loach world anymore--lol. old dogs change habits slowly.
I ramble a bit in posts--so please persevere.
I have an issue--it is correct, species spefic, information to being delivered to hobbyists by retailers. Information typically provided by retailers that should know better to hobbyists that don't. It is information delivered to Hobbyists that rely on retailers to provide honest, accutrate information about fish they sell.
I wander a number of boards. This being one of the best. I see, like most of us do, the endless threads that get into lfs or mass merchandiser bashing. Over the years I began to tune them out--even avoid them. I always thought if it bugs you that much--do something productive--let's not just complain to ourselves.
I recently stumbled into a couple of those threads elsewhere by accident. I am a long time member at one of the sites where I saw the bashing. I knew the person bashing well enough that I shared a letter I had sent to PetSmart a couple of days earlier. Only the second time in my life I had penned that type of letter--the first time dealing with the fishkeeping hobby.
The response was interesting. Never really expected it. As I said to an on-line friend, had I expected the letter to be anything other than a single "angry man" letter that mass merchandisers receive I would have written it in an entirely different fashion. With an entirely different style. But, since it was a single "angry man" letter it is what was sent.
It turns out that a number of fishkeepers from a number of other sites liked what they saw. And thought they too could do the same. I guess it turns out that fish folk do want better.
Here is that letter.
-----------------------------------------
9/16/06
Mr. Kenneth T. Hall
Sr. Vice President, Merchandising
PetSmart, Inc.
19601 North 27th Avenue
Phoenix, AZ 85027
Dear Mr. Hall,
I visited your website this morning and saw your engaging photo with “George”. That was enough to make me think that you were the individual that this correspondence would be best directed.
I visited one of your locations yesterday. I was looking for an iron supplement for a planted aquarium as well as a water conditioner. While in your store I looked at many of the fish that PetSmart sells. I was generally impressed with the quality of the tanks and the apparent health of the specimens in PetSmart tanks.
I do, however, take serious exception to the blatant misinformation evidenced on the in-store advertising. POP signage. It could be construed as misinformation designed as a cross merchandising technique to sell other product to the fish buyer. Probably simple mistakes.
Let’s take two of the signs; found on the tank to describe the species therein —if you want I would be willing to address many, many more.
Leporinus fasciatus.
In store sign says max length is 7”. This fish grows to nearly 12” (30cm).
POP signage says a 10-gallon tank will suffice. A 12” fish in a 10-gallon tank? Is the staff at PetSmart familiar with what is commonly called “stunting”? A documented anatomical and physiological occurrence resulting in deformities and often times disease and death.
The signage also calls out the requirement for Aquarium Salt. Why? The fish is found in fast moving waters of the Amazon River basin. One of the last areas you will find concentrations of Sodium Chloride remotely approximating what will happen if a fishkeeper follows your directions and adds “Aquarium Salt”. You may find mineral salts, darn few and certainly of a different nature. And, interestingly, the concentrations of the mineral salts found in the natural environment will typically be far exceeded in many of the water supplies across North America. Is Sodium chloride really “required”?
Clown Loach (Botia macracanthus/Cobitis macracanthus)
Another 7” fish if PetSmart is to be believed. And, once again they should not be. Commonly thought of as a 12”+ species this fish has proven to grow much larger in favorable environments.
A 10-gallon tank is called out on the POP signage. Most respected sources say something along the lines of a tank with the minimum of 36” length for smaller specimens (the ones you sell) and substantially larger for older fish.
Thankfully the myth of Aquarium Salt was not perpetuated with this species.
Mr. Hall, I guess my concern is that PetSmart postures itself, in so many ways, as to be interested and concerned for and about the life forms it sells to the public. To see such a blatant disregard for a non-mammal line of livestock is disconcerting.
Your company periodically receives a bashing on-line by the “new” fishkeepers. People that discover so much of what they were doing was not really a good approach to promoting fish health and longevity. A bashing delivered to relieve some of their own internal pressure when discovering that fish deaths can be avoided with appropriate care and housing. Call it “responsible husbandry”.
Does PetSmart engage in providing misleading information by design, or are the incredible number of errors in the information provided just simple mistakes? Maybe an error at the printer? Or, even the result of overzealousness by a copywriter attempting to promote cross merchandising without adequate knowledge of the fish he or she is describing?
I am not an ichthyologist, a chemist, a biologist, or a scientist of any kind. I am just a simple fishkeeper that has managed to do the research (utilizing legitimate scientific resources) to gain an understanding of what I need to do in order to avoid the easy art of killing fish. I am a fishkeeper that believes it incumbent upon retailers of your stature to do the same.
Heck, have John Gerstenberger, or the copywriters, simply go on-line to www.fishbase.org . They will find an amazing amount of scientifically based, species specific, information which may help them understand the fish you sell just a bit better. From there it is rather simple to find the competent PhD’s in the biochemistry and fish fields that will more completely fill out the knowledge base required. The legitimate information is out there with just a few clicks of the mouse. The information at the sites for many of the well recognized and respected Universities in the United States (and internationally) provides a plethora of data that discusses many of the issues you could take a leadership position with as a responsible “Pet” retailer.
Hopefully the next visit to a PetSmart will be less insulting to the senses. And, since I do enjoy PetSmart, hopefully the next visit will not be the last. Or, even the beginning of a different approach to promoting accuracy in information.
Respectfully,
cc. Robert F. Moran
Barbara Fitzgerald
Mary Miller
------------------------------------------
It seems a number of people scattered about the country, members of several other sites, have decided they dislike wrong info and are writing letters (even stealing the one you just read). Don't know that using what I wrote is best. Usually letters like that are best when someone speaks from their hearts, in their own style.
POP signage is such a routine thing. So easy to update--and frequently updated and reprinted anyway.
I just want accurate information about species.
All the stuff with pH Up and Down; Bacteria in a bottle; Aquarium Salts.....is incidental. If consumers start getting basic, accurate, information I will feel like a victory is achieved. The other crap--caveat emptor--in most cases, from my view of the world. Stores have to make money. As long as they do not harm fish with product or lie to a consumer.....
I found the adress and names contained in the letter on the PetSmart website. If you don't want to use snail mail here is an e.mail address.
corpcommunications@ssg.petsmart.com
Hopefully you feel as strongly as many others do and participate in sharing your thoughts about misleading in-store signage.
thanks for reading.
sully
___________
oh, to the folks i have shared threads or chats with in the past, if you feel a perverse need to see the originating thread it is over at that site several others here periodically stop by--or I think of as home..
and, i don't keep up as well as I should with the genus and species thing. So confused by the loach world anymore--lol. old dogs change habits slowly.
)