What size tank is needed

[Grumpy_Marine]

Ok i am new to the forums and beginner level on the fish hobby. I have two tanks currently one 29 gallon with fish listed in signature, and a 10 gallon used for breeding/QT. I am looking to upgrade to a bigger tank but need to know what size i should get to accomidate the following loaches:

2 Dojo(weather) Loaches
4 Kuhli Loaches
2 Black Kuhli Loaches
2 Albino Kuhli Loaches
2 Botia Species Loaches(not clown loaches but similar in shape)
1 horseshoe faced loach
2 striped raphael catfish
1 Pleco(unsure of exact kind something that wont get huge)

That is the list of fish my dream tank will hold. This could become a reality by end of the year if i know what size to start looking for. I know my tank is set up to create concern for experienced loach fans... i am new and pardon my newbie ways. All my loaches seem happy with their setup as they play regularly and i always see them eating and swimming, they are a very active bunch. I am just looking to get them a better home so figured where else to ask for help than a loach forums? I am looking for a tank that would be longer than it is tall as i know loaches need bigger footprint on a tank, so i don't need tall tank i need a longer one. My target size tank is between 29-55 gallons.

[shari2]

Hi Grumpy and Semper Fi! (my son is a Marine )

2 Dojo(weather) Loaches
4 Kuhli Loaches
2 Black Kuhli Loaches
2 Albino Kuhli Loaches
2 Botia Species Loaches(not clown loaches but similar in shape)
1 horseshoe faced loach
2 striped raphael catfish
1 Pleco(unsure of exact kind something that wont get huge

First of all here is the Updated Species List on the new community site. LOL is in the process of being updated. The 'community' will be the new LOL once the upgrades are finished. You can register there and look at all the species profiles.
Like Misgurnis anguillicaudatus, or weather loach.

Khulis will not be comfortable with some of the more boisterous Botia species. And 'horsefaced' loaches (I think that's what you mean?) are also fairly timid fish. Both these species prefer sand substrates (horsies sift sand through their gills to eat) , and are tropical species. Botia are also tropical species, and share similar water needs, but some get relatively large and some are quite aggressive and would not be suitable tank mates for khulis or horsefaced loaches.

Weather loaches are temperate fish. They need cooler temps than tropical species and mixing temperate species with tropical will not make either type fish a good home. What's comfortable for temperate fish is too cold for tropical and vice/versa.

There are a variety of setups you could choose to create, the size tank you get will be a major determining factor in which fish you can keep, and how many. I'd recommend getting the largest tank you can comfortably manage because larger tanks tend to be more stable and fishkeeping tends to lead to MTS (mulitple tank syndrome) as time goes by, especially if you start small. Looks like you may be succumbing already.

Another thing to consider is that most loaches are social creatures that benefit from being kept in groups of 5 (or more). You will see much more of their quirky behavior if you keep a group. They aren't what could be called 'schooling fish' but they do have something of a 'pack' mentality and develop social structure with an alpha loach (botia) and the rest of the pack, or just like to have others of their own kind to pile up with (like dojo/weather loaches or khulis).

So-first you need to decide if you are going temperate or tropical. If temperate, realize that dojo loaches can get 10" or so, and like a large footprint to their tank which will allow them to practice their crazy swimming when barometric pressure changes occur. A 55 may be ok. Khulis and horsefaced loaches can be kept in a tank as small as 20g. Botia will appreciate a 125g (especially if you keep the larger species in decent sized groups.) There are smaller botia type loaches that will be fine in a 55g, like striata, or kubotai, and a few others, like yoyos, are medium sized. Plecos are poop machines and usually need wood in their diet. Be prepared to do adequate tank maintenance. All loaches need good clear/clean water and appreciate decent flow rates (moving water) in the aquarium so good filtration is essential. Tiger barbs can be agressive and are schooling fish. You may want a larger group of them than you currently have, but keep in mind they tend to be nippy and are aggressive feeders, as I think you may have seen already. Here is a link with good info on your Common Pleco.

You could keep the khulis and horsies in the 29 and get some beautiful, peaceful, mid or top level 'dither' fish for that tank. What substrate do you have in there currently? If you get a 55 stick with the smaller loaches. The dojos may feel a bit cramped, but imo, would be ok in a 55 that is long, but as I mentioned, they will need cooler temps.

I know this is not a simple answer, but it is great that you are trying to plan ahead! You'll end up with a much happier tank and will enjoy the hobby much more if you set it up so that the fish you keep will be happy and healthy, and compatible with your water parameters. It will be less stressful for them, and less stressful for you too. Speaking of water parameters, what are yours in the 29?

Loaches don't make good inhabitants for newly set up tanks. They will suffer, you may end up treating for stress related diseases. Make sure you have a mature tank before you get them and you and they will do well.

And welcome to LOL.

[Grumpy_Marine]

Shari2 thank you for the very informative reply. Good to see that you actually research and provide a good answer. I am going to try and answer all the questions you asked so bear with me as my mind is not good with remembering things...lol j/k

First i would like to state that i have changed my mind on the list somewhat. I do not want any Biotas as they are not what i like in the loaches. That is my personal opinion... i was giving it some thought and after thinking i realized that type of loach just doesn't attract my attention yet.

I do have MTS... but that is due to walmart and their gimmicks... I quickly outgrew them and now am moving up in the world. I am aiming for a 55-75 gallon tank that is longer than it is high. I check craigslist daily as i always find deals on there.

I have noticed my barbs being aggressive but only towards eachother they seem to leave all the other fish alone.

I was dupped into the dojo by false labels on the LFS side. The store i bought mine at were labeled as a tropical community fish, after i bought them and grew attached i found they like cooler temps. But for now my dojos seem to be fairing well with the temps around 76-80 degrees. I know that is high for them but the apartment we are in heats up while we are out at work. We cool them down nightly.

Yes i did mean horsefaced loach...lol

My plan is to keep the 29 gallon tank that i have now. Sell the 10 gallon QT tank once i get another tank. The next tank i buy will be the biggie... we are getting our first house and will have many rooms to fill with things. For the family room we have decided on a nice fish tank for an attraction. I am looking for something long and short but holding at least 50 gallons or more. The 29 gallon will keep the smaller fish but the fish that need more space will move into new tank. The 29 gallon will probably be set up in the spare bedroom or the hallway don't know yet.

My tank has been up and running for about three months, i did have the loaches in there at tail end of cycle but they did ok as i never let the levels get over 2 ppm. right now my levels are:

Ammonia = 0 ppm
Nitrites = 0 ppm
Nitrates = under 10 ppm
PH 7.4-7.6 depending on how i read the test sample.

I have not added any chemicals to alter the PH as it is stable with my tap water as it is right now. I treat my tank ever W/C with the stress coat by API to dechlor the water and such.

Right now i have white gravel in the tank, the kuhlis and horseshoe are constantly burying themselves, but i am in the process of changing to a sand substrate or a river pebble substrate. That decision will come after thanksgiving holiday is over.

If you or anyone has any comments/suggestions/or ideas please let me know i am open to opinions and such.