Babies!! *Pics*

[Icewall42]

So, I felt really terrible when many of my fish died... they were my children To help with the sadness I felt, after I completely sterilized the 72 gallon, I put all the water, sand, and plants back into the tank about a week ago. I bought some new babies to fill the gap of the ones I lost. They are now in the 72g to make sure the tank is ready for the big guys that remain. So far, they are healthy and happy, just as I was sure they would be! I got 2 baby modestas and 1 baby clown. They're the cutest little devils, and it makes me feel just a little better having them.









... they like the pot!

[Mad Duff]

Nice looking fish Icewall, but I would seriously consider replacing the Clown with another Modesta. As with pretty much all Loaches they do best in shoals of there own kind and in my experiance Modestas and Clowns are not a good mix because the Modestas will eventually get way to feisty for the Clown.

[Spankenstyne]

Cute pics though

[ckk125]

Well, If you have some larger clowns, which u have..i dont think the modestas will do anything.

I used to have a few modestas sometime ago before my powerhead blew and killed all but one..since then, i cant find any replacement for them and had to keep only one with some small clowns. The modesta did bully the small clowns till i added some larger clowns...the modesta didn't even touch the clowns since then.

[stabile007]

Nice looking fish Icewall, but I would seriously consider replacing the Clown with another Modesta. As with pretty much all Loaches they do best in shoals of there own kind and in my experiance Modestas and Clowns are not a good mix because the Modestas will eventually get way to feisty for the Clown.

Well as stated in the post above this one we have two large (10" and like 7") and an younger clown who is like 3.5" as well as two older modestas who are like 5-6" long so hopefully that will keep the balance. At least I hope so since I got to name the new baby clown :-p

[Icewall42]

Don't worry, I'm aware that clowns and modestas don't make a good shoal, but as Stabile said, I do have two larger clowns and a mid-size clown that will be placed in the tank with the new clown and modestas. The big clowns keep my two older modestas in line, and they also protect their own.

Once all my big fish are in the tank, the hierarchy should assert itself. I've had modestas with clowns for qhite a few years, but since the clowns were bigger when I added them, there has never been an issue between them.

Edit: And yes, if those three baby loaches were the only ones I had or planned on having, I would agree it's a bad idea to have them together, because I do know modestas are fiesty. I would never have a situation like that if I didn't have larger fish to settle the group.

[Emma Turner]

Icewall, those are really beautiful young loaches, but I'm afraid I do have to echo what Mad Duff said. If you've kept clowns and modestas together successfully before, that is likely to have been a bit of a one-off. Adult Y. modesta can really bully clown loaches (even very large specimens) and cause them constant stress. I'd have to advise on 2 separate tanks for these species.

Emma

[Tinman]

I echo the forum. The Blue's should be seperate from the Clowns ,my modesta do well with the Tigers though.

[Icewall42]

I'll consider it, but I've kept these species together for some 5-6 years. I've never seen a more settled, happier group of loaches. And the two modestas I still have were not raised together. They were raised separately before they were introduced all into the same tank with the clowns (I'm talking 4" fish that are now in the range of 5-6").

Not once have they bullied the clowns. And I've been keeping loaches, in general, for the past 10-12 years.

If there is a problem, it will get resolved. As of now, there is no problem. And I will reiterate that I've never had one, not even when I had a huge botia helodes in with the mix. I either have extraordinary luck with fish, or there's more going on here.

It's personality, not always the species, in my experience. Had the same thing happen with angels. Some will be downright nasty, other will be peaceful. Yet again I had this happen with a severum that was once a community fish, but hated the guts of an especially mean angelfish.

My two big clowns are in a love-hate relationship. They can't stand being separated, but sometimes they duke it out. As badly as they scratch each other up soemtimes, I wouldn't dream of separating them. They are a couple. And once again, the modestas are the same way. It's hard for me to describe how unhappy they were when I had to separate them for treatment from the clowns. I got worried about how lethargic and pale they were by themselves, so I put them in the treated 30g with the clowns (a calculated risk). They brightened up immediately and were the most active fish of the tank. They still are.

Separating them causes more stress than leaving them together. How do you explain that? I can understand one fluke of a modesta. But two? Even four?

P.S. Here's another interesting tidbit. 3 of the modestas I once had, one still living, one recently dead, and one dead a couple years ago, were all in a 100g with a full grown 12"-14" albino tiger oscar. they remained that way for some months without a single problem. I allowed this setup because I knew the personality of the oscar (which I think was some 5-6 years old? I got him from an old friend), and the oscar had given up eating live fish. I don't know why he did, but he would only eat pellets and petersburg shrimp after years of eating goldfish. I'm really curious to know why, if anyone has some info regarding such a change in behavior.

These fish are like children. Some get along, others don't. It's up to me to judge their behavior instead of merely judging their species. The only species I will assume as always being mean are cichlids, but I can't say anything about interactions within cichlid species.

[Tinman]

.

P.S. Here's another interesting tidbit. 3 of the modestas I once had, one still living, one recently dead, and one dead a couple years ago, were all in a 100g with a full grown 12"-14" albino tiger oscar. they remained that way for some months without a single problem. I allowed this setup because I knew the personality of the oscar (which I think was some 5-6 years old? I got him from an old friend), and the oscar had given up eating live fish. I don't know why he did, but he would only eat pellets and petersburg shrimp after years of eating goldfish. I'm really curious to know why, if anyone has some info regarding such a change in behavior.

I think I have some explanation ,I hope it is not to windy. Your Oscar at that size was not "full"grown. I have had one over 18" .This takes a 280US gallon plus a sump for adequate airation and filtration.As the Oscar grew in a limited tank size the Oxygen level could not be maintained or would not be enough to keep the fish active and super healthy,the resulting low Oxygen would cause a diminished appetite and inactivity. Martin has many SUPERB articles on maximum air exchange in a tank that can be found on this topshelf site .The pellets and shrimp are easy to catch and eat and being somewhat lethargic in a smallish tank this MAY explain the change in diet. I personally do not use live fish as food for many reasons(especially with loaches) including but not limited to bringing in disease like Ich,or Velvet and parasites that are inherent in mass produced and maintained fish like "feeders".Live food like fish is much less nutritional than earthworms which are nearly 100% protien.Bone marrow the exception maybe.Live feeders produce lots of waste not only when alive but after going "through" the fish as they are not completely digestable.This may explain the loss of your Modesta also.i.e. the growth in the Oscar caused a depletion in the Oxygen that eventually caught up to your high Oxygen using Blue's,or the introdution of parasites or disease via the "feeders". I am not being critical of your ways and means by any stretch. I learned all this the hard way myself I completely agree about personality of Oscars,They can be night and day from each other.Albinos by nature are typicaly timid though at least in my experiance .......Tinman

[Icewall42]

Hmmm... I honestly don't know the history of the oscar, so I can't say how he was cared for. He looked to be in very good health for the short time I had him (before passing him on to a better suited keeper of oscars), so it's possible that his appetite changed for he reasons you gave. However, when I had him, he was most certainly not lethargic or unhealthy looking. He would cause nightly irritation (huge splashes that woke me up), he would constantly swim back and forth, and he actively picked on a huge pleco that was also in the tank. He was a pig when it came to shrimp! So, who knows.

I also should have clarified that none of the three mdoestas that were in the oscar tank died while they were with the oscar. They were moved into a 55g to join another modesta, and after a number of months (after I gave the oscar away) all laoches were moved from the 55g into the 100g for probably another couple years. The first of the 4 modestas died from strange brown patches/denting around his head. It wasn't contagious. The other modesta died very recently from the epidemic I had in the 72g. I still have two remaining modestas. So, no Blues were affected in the oscar tank for the motnhs they were in it.

[Tinman]

I stand corrected

[Icewall42]

No problem, it was my fault I only ever want the best for my fish, I hope everyone understands that. Like I said, if there's a problem, the baby clown (with some baby clown buddies) will go into the 30g to grow up. Once they are bigger, they will be reintroduced into the 72g with my other, bigger clowns. I have confidence that it will work out, given what I know about the personalities of my older fish.

If not... I know what to do. But keep in mind that I've had a good chunk of experience with fish, even though it's not perfect!