Loaches Online Forum

Folks,
The mod-squad is having a drama. All seem to have a lot of blotching of the skin and one has a good few (what look like light) scratches, and the largest looks sickly, is panting/breathing fast and seems to have a cloudiness over her eyes. I've done a major vacuum, substrate-stir, re-landscape and 50% water change (yesterday) and will do the same for the decorations of the other side of the tank tomorrow. A few points of note:
a) my tanks seems to get "sick spots": popular hiding spots where the fish mainly using it gets sort of chronic skin dramas. I move the item, vacuum around the spot and everything gets better. Is this some sort of "old tank syndrome"?
b) I lost three small/medium lace gouramis over the last 2 weeks, one at a time. They'd get a colour change in a patch often associated with tormenting from the other fish, then disappear completely. I'm guessing they'd get very tired or die and the catfish(s) would eat them, but never saw any particular stomach extension or fish-bits. They just vanished. I wonder if I've got a predatory prawn in the undergrowth, but no signs of one of those either. When I saw this happening I was in and out for work and didn't get a chance to change water, only cleaned filters. Water was not particularly old.
c) largest Y.mod is being caught up to by the middle one, causing some territorial strife. Also, Synodontis is growing faster then all, and is now large enough that he runs the show. I think this/these may be part of the scratching on the middle Y.mod. Would such stress cause this panting over days?

What next? Water's too hot (29C) for Ich infestation to gills, but any suggestions on helping my big girl out with this obvious distress? She does seem a little better with the water change (eyes a little clearer), but still not good. A little sea-salt? Water anti-chorinator: supposed to be good for gills and skin? Almond leaves?

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Do you have some water parameters? Ammonia, nitrites, and Nitrates? KH and GH of the tank and the source water for water changes would be helpful also. TDS would be even better. pH would be nice to know also.

If it was OTS, then large water changes can make problems worse.

If you have sick or infected fish, you really need to quarantine them because bacterial problems can spread. Especially if those fish die and are getting eaten by the others. You got to stop that from happening in the future.

Columnaris disease might be the problem. That seems to spread more with with warmer water temperatures. UV sterilizers can help keep those bacterial levels to a minimum. I've never had success in treating that kind of bacterial infection though. I end up quarantining the infected fish for a long time while trying every possible treatment, and I end up euthenizing the fish. I only know how to prevent the infections from happening.

Good water quality and steady water chemistry is the best way to prevent outbreaks. Frequent small water changes, instead of large water changes, is what I recommend. Twice 20% weekly's.

Keith,
Thanks. I've not been able to get a testing kit in MoBay- i'll try to get one in Kingston next week, or through a contact at the Water Commission on Monday.
I'll agree, I absolutely should have removed the sick gouramis as they showed signs, certainly when it appeared to be contagious. Stupid and way too busy- bad time management for which my fish suffer. Stupid.
Don't have a Q-tank (space considerations in small apartment) but that's a poor excuse.

I'll also agree that it seems to be bacterial. We used to use a bit of salt and a bit of Eurthromycin (spelling) for general bacterial drama. If you've got suggestions, my vet's my neighbour. She's got no idea beyond cats and dogs, but can write prescriptions for emulsions that seem very potent.

Fingers crossed for now.
How about an almond leaf? They're supposed to be anti-bacterial.
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You are right that places the fish seem to hang out can carry a higher load of infectious stuff. Often caves and similar structures have poor water flow, and the bacteria and other things can accumulate. One way to deal with this is to add a pump or power head near these structures to increase the water movement. Another way to help is to aim the gravel vac into these areas every time you clean the tank.

Erythromycin is good against Gram positive bacteria, and has some slight action against Gram negative bacteria. Many fish diseases are Gram negative bacteria. Kanamycin, Minocycline and the sulfas are better against Gram negative bacteria.
Here is a site with a list of fish problems and the meds that this company sells that can help.
http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/

Plants can have antibacterial properties. This is natural to fish that come from rain forest streams and rivers. The fallen leaves can contribute to slower growth of bacteria, and a healthy fish can fight off the bacteria easier. I know that peat moss can have this effect. Tree branches that fall into a peat bog may not rot for many years, because of the low pH that reduces the activity of the microorganisms. It would not hurt to add Almond Leaves to the tank.

Old tank syndrome is when there has been long term poor maintenance and the nitrate is rising, slowly enough for most of the fish to adapt, but it gets way too high for new fish to tolerate. As the nitrate rises the pH drops, the KH also drops, then the nitrifying bacteria can die off. Your tests would likely show something like this:
Ammonia rising
pH in the low 6s
Nitrate way over 50 ppm, I have seen reports of it over 100ppm.
KH 0-3 degrees.
Water will usually still be clear.

There does seem to be something going on in your tank, but I do not know what it is. Tests would help.

Scratches and minor injuries on the fish are often from other fish, and may be from sharp objects in the tank. Many Loaches have spines near their eyes and can attack each other with these weapons. Many catfish are also armed.
These injuries will heal if the water is kept clean, lowest possible nitrates.
The cause should be looked into, also, and corrected.

The fast growing catfish suggests that he ate the other dead fish.

The odd coloration and rapid breathing suggests the fish are having problems from something, but not what is causing the problem. Warmer water holds less oxygen. Increasing the water movement can help.

Our girl succumbed overnight in QT.
Looked like she was rallying yesterday AM after a night on Ospexin (broad spec Antibiotic) but I guess it was wishful observation.
Annoyed. Fish was touching on 4.5", robust and tough as nails.
The mid-sized one is still blotchy, but eating and breathing normally. Looks like crap (brindle loach?) but otherwise seems fine (touch wood).

Now tank as one of each of three Botia sp. (orange-fin, yellow-fin and clown), so generating viable schools will cost me a bomb...
The search starts today...
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