Loaches Online Forum

My clown loaches have ich (as far as I can tell) and both seem to have difficulty with buoyancy regulation. One seems more affected than the other, and is sporting filamentous bits in addition to pustules. I can't tell if its hanging necrotic tissue or a fungus. Both are respirating quickly and neither are eating.

It is a fairly well mixing tank, i have 2 powerheads running my UGF and an over the top filter (fluval 305, prefilter / empty / biomax) The water quality is fine - i've been monitoring it very carefully, however the phosphates are off the scale (planted tank) and I've had lots of trouble keeping the water hardened (perhaps my calcium ions are linking up and becoming calcium phosphate?). The tap water is also very soft.

I've been treating with QuICK cure (formalin/malachite green) for about a week at half strength and running my vortex diatom filter on and off (it is indicated the extra flow might stress them further). I have been adding some aquarium salt (about 8-10 tablespoons in 55 gallons) and have done one large (50%) water change in the middle of treatment. The temperature has been slightly elevated (80-82) but I do not want to stress the other fish as none of them seem at all affected. In addition to this I've been slowly trying to harden the water in an effort to get my plants growing better to use up some phosphate. It comes in with the tap water.
So far I've added one tablespoon of epsom salt (1/2 per day) and one teaspoon of sodium bicarb. I've also crushed up one 600mg calcium supplement (carbonate), no flavors and vegetable or cellulose based binders (vegetable magnesium stearate, cross-linked cellulose)

Stats
55gal
80-82 F
NH3 = 0
NO2- = 0
NO3 = 10-20
pH = 7 (it has been dipping to 6.6, which is why I've been trying to gently harden it)
PO4 = 5-10
GH = 3 dH
KH = 1 dH
12hr light/dark (changed from 8hr light at suspect of fungus)
was set up from june to nov 09 then I moved to my new apt for dec 09, set up and running fine since, no issues from move

Other fish - 2 pink kisser gouramis, dinosaur bichir eel, peacock eel, 2 aus rainbowfish, 2 redeye tetras, 1 leopard bushfish, 1 african knife, rubbermouth pleco, standard pleco, tiger barb - well behaved community tank for the most part.

I'm concerned about adding too much bicarb and causing the pH to scream to 8 once the plants use up the phosphate (it buffers around 6.5, right?) I have heard of people using phosphate remover and causing their pH to completely crash. I added some fast growing plants (hygro. spp.) but they aren't really taking off. Should I add more calcium carbonate? Epsom salt? If so, how much?

What other treatments can I try that are compatible with the ich treatment so my loaches might start eating again? They do not seem visibly bloated or skinny but they could be both skinny and bloated and I may miss it.

Please help! My wife will be devastated if we lose the loaches.

Edit: somewhat legible shot, see if you can see anything interesting..

Plant issues
As far as the plants using up the phosphate, do not worry about it. While that level is a bit high, I do not think it is really causing problems directly. Maybe indirectly? Helping the plants to thrive so they will remove most of the phosphate is a good goal.

How much and what kind of lighting?

I would add carbonates (sodium bicarbonate or other) to raise the KH to 3 degrees. Test and keep it there. This will help stabilize the pH.

GH of 3 is as low as I would want it to get. I would try adding Ca and Mg in a ratio of 4 parts Ca to 1 part Mg for the plants, if the GH drops, or if the plants are showing deficiency of these.

Are you adding CO2? This might be the trigger that kicks the plants into using more of the phosphate and other nutrients. Make sure you can keep the KH at 3 degrees, though, or the CO2 will crash the pH. Perhaps Seachem Excel would be better in this case.

Are you adding any trace minerals?

Continue to closely monitor all these values. As the plants start growing better any of these may get used up pretty fast. Be ready to supplement with whatever is needed. The irregular deficiency that can be caused this way can trigger algae, as well as making it difficult for the plants to grow.

Fish Issues
Stuff coming off Loaches:
Loaches will produce then shed excess slime coat when something bothers them. Often this can be water chemistry (pH, Ammonia, salt, other) or parasites.

'Floaty':
Usually this suggests a problem with the swim bladder, but a somewhat related issue is osmo-regulatory issues. When the water the fish are in gets softer, less GH, less minerals, lower level of all the things in the water, the fish have a difficult time coping. Too much water enters their cells, and the fish is not used to that. The best treatment is to add things to the water to make it like it was before whatever happened that removed the minerals. It is easy to do this with Epsom salt. BUT if this raised the magnesium level more than the plant need, they may not be too happy about it. Plants prefer a ratio of 4:1 Ca: Mg. To solve this dilemma, I would add both Epsom salt and Calcium.

Loss of appetite:
Try adding garlic to the food. You can buy a garlic additive in fish and pet stores, or simply mash a clove of garlic and soak their food in it.

Ich:
A parasite. There is so much about Ich at this site I am not going to make this post longer. About half the posts in this health and disease forum are about Ich.

Tap water issues
Ich can be reduced in the tank if you can do more water changes. Not specifically the volume of water that you change, but how thoroughly you can vacuum the floor of the tank, and how frequently. I understand about tap water with phosphate that can be a problem. The easiest solution is to run some water into a garbage can and run a filter on it. Put into the filter one of those phosphate removing products, such as a resin pouch, or a treated floss pad. When the phosphate has been significantly reduced, (about 1 ppm is a good amount for plants) then add whatever you have found necessary for the plants, and to keep the GH and KH in the ranges suggested above. Add dechlor if needed. You can keep the water warm in this garbage can with an aquarium heater.
Then do the water change.

Thanks for the reply! Unfortunately the more sickly loach is dead. It was covered in a thick mucus when I pulled it from the tank. The other loach ate a couple garlic bloodworms today, but is in the corner swimming in place facing upward the corner of the tank, like he's treading water.

I used a large water change/thorough gravel vac along with a few hours of zeolite / charcoal filtering to remove the old quICK cure and have switched to rid-ich+ full strength (after taking out the carbon of course). I'm planning on vacc'ing the third section of the gravel (I do 1/3 at a time) as i've hit the other two hard over the last couple days.

I added a GH mix from my LFS (mostly K2O, with some calcium, Mg, Mn, Fe, all purportedly water soluble)
as well as seachem flourish trace minerals and seachem excel (20mL of each as per instructions)

I'm going to do a 25% change and re-dose tomorrow evening. I'll repost with water stats after that. Any further thoughts on his behavior? Still hyperventilating though he has somewhat fewer spots.

Ich can get into the gills, and this fish moght have a large parasite load right where it makes it hard to breathe. Keep the oxygen level high with plenty of aeration.
Keep up the water changes, especially the vacuuming.

Things are going well, but I'm a bit concerned about my phosphate / pH levels.

PO4: 3
pH: 7.2
GH: 5-6
KH: 2
no ammonia or nitrites, nitrate is low

My eel has completely cleared up and the lch is almost cured as well, and of course I plan to keep the treatment up longer after they clear up. The loach is eating again and picking at the gravel (which he hasn't done in ages!). However, I'm worried that as my plants use up the phosphate my pH will continue to rise, and I'm one KH dH away from where I should be. What can I do to stabilize my pH at 7? I have heard of seachem's alkaline and acid buffers but I'm not sure if they will be effective.