clown with nasty lump

tender · Post by **tender** » Tue May 20, 2008 6:04 pm

Hi!
I have a tank with 5 pakistans,5 skunks and 5 clowns.
One of the clowns suddenly developed two nasty wounds on the belly and it almost looked like it`s intestines were coming out

I have done daily water-changes to prevent the wounds from becoming infected.) Initially I thought there would be no hope for this clown. But as the days have gone by he/she is still hanging in there... However; the body is now "crooked"? The flesh wounds have gone away, but there is still a big lump under the belly. The clown is not acting normally, but is still alive and occationally swimming around in the tank. Most of the time it hides, but at feeding time it comes out for a bite. Today I noticed that the lump had turned white which I assume means it is infected. I have started treatment with Protozine as this is supposed to help against infections/fungus etc. The symptoms seems to be quite like Fishtuberkoloses but, frankly I have no idea whats going on. However, the clown is still hanging in there and it`s been almost a week now.

Anybody who has any idea what this might be or whats going on?

Kind regards
Marius

Emma Turner · Post by **Emma Turner** » Tue May 20, 2008 6:55 pm

Hi there Marius,

As they say, a picture speaks a thousand words - any chance you could get a quick photo? Are all the water parameters ok? Do you see much aggression towards the clowns from the other more boisterous loaches?

Emma

tender · Post by **tender** » Tue May 20, 2008 7:02 pm

I have tried and tried to take pictures. I sat two hours in front of the tank but it is simply impossible. Eventhough the Clown is sick it still has its speed intact, and it hides 95% of the time. The others kind of "poke" at him/her which is normal when an individual is "out of shape" but they dont seem to harrass it. Even the skunks seems to leave it pretty much alone. Water parameters are fine. Low nitrates, temp approx 25-26.

Blue · Post by **Blue** » Tue May 20, 2008 8:26 pm

Yoyos would never be capable of such damage. Skunks do. Is there a chance for you to consider separating the skunks, Marius? I made a mistake before of mixing skunk loaches with my yoyos and clowns and they managed to kill 2 yoyos tearing apart one's head. I regret it up to this day.

Edit: I wouldn't be too sure skunks would leave them alone if I were you, Marius. Better separate them than to let another incident like that to happen.

chefkeith · Post by **chefkeith** » Tue May 20, 2008 11:54 pm

You should always quarantine sick or injured fish.

Emma Turner · Post by **Emma Turner** » Wed May 21, 2008 10:49 am

Hi Marius,

I also would not keep skunk loaches with clowns, and it would be best to separate them as soon as possible, particularly now one of the clown loaches is unwell.

Whilst it is difficult to diagnose without seeing the fish, I don't think Protozin is the best course of treatment here either. Do you have access to antibiotics where you are?

Emma

tender · Post by **tender** » Wed May 21, 2008 1:44 pm

Hi!
The problem is that I have nowhere to put the skunks at the moment. I`m starting a new tank in about two weeks,and then the skunks will be separated, but until then it`s difficult. I could move the clowns into another tank I have which also has clowns in it, but this tank is already quite "overloaded" and a bit to small.(I`m waiting for my new much bigger tank). Also I`m worried about the sick clown beeing removed, will it handle the stress of catching,moving, new enviroment and tank-mates?

On the up-side of things

Today the sick clown is more lively, swimming with the others and eating. Also the lump seems to be not quite so white as yesterday. Could it be the Protozin? Like Emma I was also sceptical to Protozin but at my favourite fish-shop the guy who runs it is a biologist and recommended it as it is supposed to treate infections?

Emma: What kind of antibiotic/substance would you reccomend?

Last question; should I do a water-change before adding Protozin today or should I leave that for the 3 days the medication is going to be used?

Emma Turner · Post by **Emma Turner** » Wed May 21, 2008 2:56 pm

Hi Marius,

If you are confident that the loach is looking much better today, I would be inclined to stick with the treatment you are using, rather than changing to another at this stage.

I would not do a water change until the course of Protozin is complete, which is also what the manufacturer recommends.

Good luck and keep us updated,

Emma

tender · Post by **tender** » Wed May 21, 2008 3:04 pm

Hi Emma!
Well its difficult to be confident, but I see it much more and it eats

I`m performing the half dosage of Protozin as recommended, but I seem to remember that you have said something about doing it every 12 hours instead of every 24 hours?

What do you think about the idea of moving the fish to my other Clown-tank?

Kind regards
Marius

Emma Turner · Post by **Emma Turner** » Wed May 21, 2008 3:19 pm

It is a difficult decision because you don't know for sure what caused this problem. It may well be an injury, but you wouldn't want to move the fish in with a healthy group in case it is a health issue and you transfer something to your other group.

Any chance of a local store looking after your skunks until your new tank arrives?

Protozin does biodegrade very quickly, so yes, my preference is to dose every 12 hours with half the recommended amount.

Emma

tender · Post by **tender** » Wed May 21, 2008 3:57 pm

Here are two very bad pictures:
http://s294.photobucket.com/albums/mm81 ... dbyll1.jpg

and

http://s294.photobucket.com/albums/mm81 ... dbyll2.jpg

Also please look at the eyes. the entire eye appears to be totally black. I believe this is another symptom of fishTub?

Getting worried here?

Kind regards
Marius

tender · Post by **tender** » Fri May 23, 2008 9:23 am

Hi again!
Just a short update here. The clown is still hanging in there

It seems somewhat more lively everyday. It even took on a skunk in a fight for an Algae-wafer today

However it still seems to rest more than the others and the lump is still there. The best way I can describe it is that it looks like a pimple which is about to burst.

Keeping my fingers crossed

Kind regards
Marius

tender · Post by **tender** » Sun May 25, 2008 9:27 am

The lump has now fallen off! The remaining problem is that the Clown is so skinny that I`m worried about it being able to get back into shape.

What food would you reccomend to "fatten" it up. I have Brineshrimp, Algea-wafers, shrimp-pellets, red mosquitolarvae and a special high-protein food. The problem is that, loaches beeing loaches, I`m worried the others will out-compete it for the food

mistergreen · Post by **mistergreen** » Sun May 25, 2008 5:18 pm

you'd have to raise it separately if it's being out-competed.
And don't feel the need to overfeed because he's skinny.. it'll take time.

Emma Turner · Post by **Emma Turner** » Mon May 26, 2008 12:57 pm

Hi Marius,

How is the clown loach today? I hope it is still recovering well.

With regards to feeding, adult brineshrimp is not very nutritious, so I would not feed too much of that. Sinking catfish pellets, Tetra Prima, and a mixture of frozen foods such as white mosquito larvae, bloodworm, finely chopped shrimp (Mysis, krill etc)/prawn/cockle etc should all be taken eagerly.

Good luck and keep up with the good water quality,

Emma

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