Another new river manifold project

[Sharkscott2]

I just purchased a 125 gallon off of Craigslist. I plan on moving 8 Syncrossus Berdmorei and 8 Arulius barbs in there once it's set up.

I'd like to make a river manifold but my plan differs slightly from the one described in the article by Martin Thoene. I'm sure my ideas aren't unique but would like some feedback on them.

I plan on having 4 intakes and 2 power heads. I'm going to design for 4 power heads but only start with two, I'll add the others on as funding catches up. I've already purchased 2 Aquaclear 110 power heads.

The grid I'd like to make is based around the idea of avoiding 90 degree angles.

The standard design outlined by Martin looks something like this (pardon the ascii art)

|===~====|
|...............|
S..............P
|...............|
|===~====|
|...............|
S..............P
|...............|
|===~====|


Any path from the S(sponge) to a P (power head) takes 4 90 degree turns.
- 1 coming down from the sponge and turning left or right.
- 1 at the corner or center of the left hand side turning right
- 1 at the corner or center of the right hand side turning towards the power head
- 1 turning upright to go into the power head.

My idea would be something like:


S===~==
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~==

In this setup from the middle two sponges the water would get to the power head in as little as 2 90 degree turns.
- 1 coming down from the sponge.
- 1 coming up to the power head

The outer sponges would still take at least 3 90 degree turns to reach a power head.
- 1 coming down from the sponge.
- 1 at the right hand side corners turning towards the power head.
- 1 turning up into the power head.


To take this a step further my plan would be eventually to expand out something like this :


S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~===P

Using two Aquaclear 110s in the center and two Aquaclear 70s in the corners.



My last idea was to use two 45 degree angle PVC tubes coming down from the sponges and going up to the power heads. Thus potentially eliminating the need for any water to make a 90 degree turns. 4 45s instead of 2 90s.


Thoughts?

[bookpage]

I sure don't know all there is about river manifolds, but let me tell you about the one I made. I used two Maxi Jet Power Heads that are rated at 295 GPH. See the video on my post.

If you use two Aquaclear 110 power heads, that is 1800 GPH and with four that would be 3600 GPH. For the fish that you are going to put in the tank, that seems like a way lot of current.

Hopefully some of the other, more experienced with river manifolds will post later on.

[Diana]

Look into sweep bends. These are available in the electrical department. PVC Conduit for electric is the same size fittings as irrigation PVC (Not CPVC, though). It is grey, so might hide a bit better in case you cannot cover it all.

If you have room, or have a few rocks to hide the sweeps there is less pressure loss through a sweep 90 compared to a conventional (tight turn) irrigation PVC 90* elbow.

There are a lot of ways to plumb these things, but you are on the right track to reduce pressure loss:
larger diameter pipe, and fewer fittings.

Have a look also at how to modify the Aquaclear Power Heads to get the rated flow out of them. This article also has a few variations in plumbing layout.

http://www.loaches.com/articles/water-m ... h-aquarium

I have used a few variations myself. The simplest is this: Front elevation. periods are just place holders and are really not there.
Down from the sponge, 90*, straight run of pipe, 90* up to power head. This may fall over, so a couple of rocks to stabilize it helps. (Suction cups of the PH bracket are getting old.)
I do not glue the parts that are under water. If they leak... what does it hurt? Then I can change the layout if needed.

S.....................P
|____________|

in my 125 gallon tank I have around 20x the tank volume of water movement, but mine is not a river tank. I have several filters and power heads.

[Sharkscott2]

Bookpage,
I certianly understand what you're saying about the GHP being high, it seems like a lot to me too. I don't plan on using 4 110s but 2 110s and 2 70s (if I feel comfortable). Making my max flow somewhere around 2600 gph (1800+800). To start with i'll just be using 2 110s but I'd like to build the plumbing so I could expand down the road.

Is 2600 or even 3600 gph too much? I've read several places and Diana states it again that 20x the tank volume per hour is getting near ideal. 125x20 = 2500 gph. So I would be in the ball park with 2600 gph. Further more in these setups it's my impression that you won't get peak preformance from your power heads anyway so I probably won't ever get the full 2600 gph, but maybe 2000 is achievable.

Diana,
Thanks for the idea on where to find sweeping tubes. I was looking for exactly that at Lowes in their pvc section.

My idea is similiar to the one you drew out below, except i'd use multiple sponge intakes and multiple power heads and grid them together for stabilities sake.

[bookpage]

Diana, knows much more than I about these kind of things. I just thought it was too much current for the fish you were going have in the tank.

Are you going to have any kind of filter also? To me, 20x the tank volume per hour can also be achieved using several filters. But, that's just me.

[Sharkscott2]

I keep the S. Berdmorei loaches in a 40 long now. I have a 900 gph power head, a 380 gph power head and a aqua clear 70 filter which is 300 gph.

I think that adds up to over 1500 gph in a 40 gallon. Mind you that isn't all channeled in one direction. But the loaches do just fine in it. Having enough space to establish territories is their current problem.

[Martin Thoene]

Sharkscott2, your ultimate design is entirely logical to me. The straightest shot you can give the water between intake and a powerhead the less inherent frictional losses there will likely be in the pipework. All your lengthways pipes can be gridded together using T-joints so the whole structure retains shape and stability. Primary water flow will just shoot straight through, but the cross pipes allow inter pipe balancing out of the flow.

The only limit on how one designs a River-Tank manifold is the dimensions of the tank and of the powerheads and intake sponges.

I think when Diana talks about 20 X tunover per hour she means for Hillstream loaches. For S. berdmorei you don't really need to be looking at that high a turnover. They will however appreciate a decent current.

Whilst I designed the River-tank manifold initially for Hillstream Loaches, by downsizing the powerheads one can create an end to end flow in the tank without it being the maelstrom that Hillstreams will enjoy. All sorts of fish can benefit from a more gentle flow.

Martin.

[bookpage]

Shark, you said:

My idea would be something like:


S===~==
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~===P
..|.........|
S===~==

I have been thinking about this and can't seem to figure out what parts would be needed for the powerhead and sponge to be on the same PVC and connected to the frame.


--|--


The PVC would have to have four openings; left side opening, right side opening, top opening for power head and a 90 degree opening going to the PVC that goes to the sponge. Right?

Think you could get that part and take a picture and post it?

[Sharkscott2]

I put together a preliminary frame last night. I still don't have my sponges and I may still change it up a bit. My wife took some pics this morning i'll see if I can post it tonight which will probably be the best way to answer your question.

But i'll try to do it in text for lack of anything else to do durning my lunch break.

On one length of pipe i'll have the follow:

sponge
emptying down into a 45 degree turn
a second 45 degree turn (making 90 degrees total)
a cross shapped piece which connects to other tubes
long straight piece of tubing across the bottom of the tank
another cross
45 degree turn upwards
a second 45 degree turn
small piece of pipe
power head

Hope that helps,

[bookpage]

I appreciate the info, but I am kind of a visual person.

[Sharkscott2]

[bookpage]

Now I see it. Looking good. Think I may be able to use some of your design for my 125. Will get PVC and take pictures tomorrow.

Think I will use two AC 70s (802) for mine.