Substrate issues!!!!

[Kit-Kat]

Hi, I am a new member who already has a question!! We 'adopted' our first Weather Loach last September, bought three more, and lost two I'm afraid. But that's another story....and it's all sorted out now. But....we decided to change the substrate [Mickeys' previous owner had gravel]. We bought sand from an Aquatic Centre near where we live [which I'm sure was only play-pit sand, sold as Aquatic Sand]. We put it in for when we got him [so last September] and, even though I stir it every week when I do the water change, it went black. Three weeks ago we had to put them in a spare tank [to do with the loss of the other two] and I put new sand in....and it's gone black already!! I've done three water changes and stirred the sand each time. Today I bought 6 bags of Pewter Sand, cleaned it and got it all ready....and now I'm worried that it's wrong!! I can't find anything about it.....does any one have any ideas about this sort of sand please? Thanks in advance, Kit-Kat.

[Diana]

Sand that has been sifted so all the particles are the same size is the best. Around here such sand is sold in a couple of ways. Look for 30 mesh, or 30 grit, or 1mm sized particles. coarser is OK, too. "30 mesh" means the sand will be stopped by a screen that has 30 strands per inch. There are not too far off of 30 mm in one inch, so either way it is labeled is fine. Coarser material might be labeled 15 mesh or 20 mesh, or 1.5 mm or 2 mm.
It is used in swimming pool filters, so a store that supplies contractors with pool supplies will carry it. I got 30 mesh locally.
It is used in sand blasting. Several sizes are available. Might be a sharply angled material, though.
It is sold in bags, and labeled with the size for whatever purpose you want. Around here there is some really nice sand available in many sizes in bags. I go to the local rock yard, or masonry store.
Get a sample (a handful or so, not much), and test it in a glass of water. If the sample changes the GH, KH or pH of the water, then do not use that sand in an aquarium.

Sand that turns black so fast is not good. Increase the water movement in the tank, and only use 1/2" or about 1cm deep of this sort of material. Better to go with a fine, rounded gravel, not this sort of sand.

[Kit-Kat]

Hi Diana, thanks for that...the only trouble is I can't find any that says the size on it. I don't live near any decent Aquatic Centres and when I saw the Pewter Sand it looked just right....trouble is I can't find out anything about it!! I cleaned it all last night and put it in the tank ready....supposed to be putting the boys back in their proper home tonight and I just felt that I would be happier if anyone could tell me about the Pewter Sand that's already in there!! I don't want different colours, I like the natural look. It does say on the bags that it's suitable for ALL types of aquariums, and that it doesn't change the water chemistry. I don't have the confidence to buy anything that doesn't say it's suitable for aquariums....I got caught with the last bag of sand!! By the looks of it nobody knows about this type of sand, which is a little worrying!! I suppose I've just got to be trusting [it does come from a well known pet 'stuff' manufacturer!! Thanks again, Kit-Kat.

[bookpage]

Found these sites on Google:

http://tinyurl.com/3dfzct8

[Diana]

Often bags of sand leak or tear. Look on the shelf for a 'sample' that you can take home and test.

Anyway, by keeping the layer really shallow you allow the water movement to keep the substrate well aerated, and this reduces the chance of the anaerobic bacteria living in the sand.

Make sure that whatever filter, power head or other water moving equipment is doing a good job of circulating the water all over the tank. You can test this most easily by dropping fish food in different areas and watching what happens to it. I have found that If I start with about 10 times the tank volume per hour I can get a good pattern of water movement. So a 29 gallon tank will have 290 or so gallons per hour. Some of this is from the filter, some from a power head. A 200 liter tank would start with around 2000 liters per hour of water movement.
Try to arrange this water movement in one pattern. If you have a filter, a power head and a bubble wand then set them up so they enhance each others' flow, not cut across it.

[redshark1]

Firstly, congratulations on your weather loaches, they are lovely animals and secondly well done for seeking advice in order to give them the best care.

Sorry, I don't yet understand why your sand has gone black but it doesn't sound good to me, suggesting anaerobic nutrient-loaded conditions. Is it smelly (ideally it should not smell at all)? I don't want to cause upset by suggesting you may be overfeeding, but it is so easy to do.

Neither do I know of Pewter sand, but it suggests dark grey colour to me.

Perhaps you could please give a detailed description of your tank, feeding and filtration, water testing parameters etc.

In the meantime I'll describe my sand and how I use it because it may help.

The only sand I have experience of and can recommend is Silver Sand (for horticultural use). I use it in two of my tanks (4ft non-planted Catfish and 3ft non-planted Angelfish). It looks great to my eyes. I have not tried the pool sand but from what other people have said this is clearly recommended too.

I use 2cms depth, good water movement (meaning oxygenated water flows through all the sand) and good filtration (meaning wastes are trapped and made safe). I change 25% of water weekly.

I find that dirt does not sink into the sand but stays on top until it is kicked into the water current by the fish and collected by the filters which are positioned well above to avoid trapping the sand. But I am careful not to stock/feed too much.

I washed it when new but it wasn't at all dirty and could have been used straight from the bag, so I would just test a bit first.

My sand never looks anything other than brand new and squeaky clean in my applications. I think with a few adjustments you will be able to achieve this too.

[lindalc]

I'm new:
I would like to understand more about the substrate, filter and cleaning the water. I assume the filter must be well above the
sand (how much). How do you clean the water without getting the sand, don't you need to clean the sand also.
Linda

="redshark1"]Firstly, congratulations on your weather loaches, they are lovely animals and secondly well done for seeking advice in order to give them the best care.

Sorry, I don't yet understand why your sand has gone black but it doesn't sound good to me, suggesting anaerobic nutrient-loaded conditions. Is it smelly (ideally it should not smell at all)? I don't want to cause upset by suggesting you may be overfeeding, but it is so easy to do.

Neither do I know of Pewter sand, but it suggests dark grey colour to me.

Perhaps you could please give a detailed description of your tank, feeding and filtration, water testing parameters etc.

In the meantime I'll describe my sand and how I use it because it may help.

The only sand I have experience of and can recommend is Silver Sand (for horticultural use). I use it in two of my tanks (4ft non-planted Catfish and 3ft non-planted Angelfish). It looks great to my eyes. I have not tried the pool sand but from what other people have said this is clearly recommended too.

I use 2cms depth, good water movement (meaning oxygenated water flows through all the sand) and good filtration (meaning wastes are trapped and made safe). I change 25% of water weekly.

I find that dirt does not sink into the sand but stays on top until it is kicked into the water current by the fish and collected by the filters which are positioned well above to avoid trapping the sand. But I am careful not to stock/feed too much.

I washed it when new but it wasn't at all dirty and could have been used straight from the bag, so I would just test a bit first.

My sand never looks anything other than brand new and squeaky clean in my applications. I think with a few adjustments you will be able to achieve this too.[/quote]

[UVvis]

I'm new:
I would like to understand more about the substrate, filter and cleaning the water. I assume the filter must be well above the
sand (how much). How do you clean the water without getting the sand, don't you need to clean the sand also.
Linda

Linda,

The first thing to remember is your water quality and artificially created environment is one of the largest factors in maintaining fish health.

Substrates:

For most freshwater tanks, you are going to be looking for two key factors in substrate selection. These are having a substrate of uniform size and having it be chemically inert in your system. The next key to pay attention to regards the overall surface area of the substrate. More surface area means more sites for biofilm growth where bacteria can bond.

The uniform size of the particles means that the open spaces between particles will be consistent across the substrate bed. This is important as the greater the size of the open spaces, the greater the rates of diffusion in/out of the substrate, and the more water flow you can have through the bed. Uneven sized particles will compact and essentially trap pockets of water. These isolated pockets can host anaerobic activity are usually fine if left alone, however, they represent a risk to the system as the chemistries are usually not compatable with fish life, and often toxic. This is why Diana mentioned above minimizing the depth of sand bed.

The issues with sand in regards to substrate is that it is both difficult to keep water flow through the bed and conventional siphoning is not always an option. The small particle sizes and densities usually mean that increased water flow will move, lift and send these particles everywhere.

Maintenance & Water Quality:

For a sand substrate, you need to pay attention to where your filter intake is. If it is to close, you can draw in filter clogging/damaging sand particles. This will be unique based on your system's size, shape, water flow and circulation.

If you remember that the increased surface area leads to increase area for biofilms and combine this with sand being a little more difficult to clean than fine gravel, you will likely want to step up water changes and look at filtration with a closer eye. Like in any system, the more material that you remove before it is broken down by bacteria, the less overall accumulation you will have in your system. This decreases the nutrient loading and overal bacteria/algae population you can host. Increased frequence and volume of water changes can help with this. For sand, having filtration and water flow of suffient levels unique to the system/sand type, you can minimize the amount of detritus that settles on the sand.

To help clean the sand, I've seen a wide variety of methods used. Plants and trumpet snails are some natural ways to reduce the waste/nutrient build up in the systems as they both dig through the bed of sand looking for nutrients. Some will swirl a siphon above the substrate to lift up lighter debris than the sand, and export them with their dirty water. I've seen some special cone shaped cleaners made to have face velocities high enough for debris, but not so high that the sand will come too. Disrupting the sand bed is good as it will keep the number of anaerobic pockets minimized. It is also worth mentioning that many folks expect to loose their substrate slowly over time, and often will buy extra substrate sand to 'top off' their substrate bed later.

One of the more interesting systems I have seen was a modified marine system with a plenum under the sand to keep water flow through the sand and detritus on the surface of the sand. The system was able to have flow increased to the point that it almost acted like a sand filter under backwash conditions with the debris being lifted away from the sand. The owner of the system told me that she would NEVER EVER do this again due to the work it took to get it working correctly.

Not sure if any of this is helpful.

[Kit-Kat]

Hello, I'm sorry I didn't get back about this sooner....not been very well.

But....I bought some Pewter Sand [very, very pale sand - more 'grainey' than play-type sand] and I've put it in the Loach tank and my little boys' aquatic frog tank. It has been FANTASTIC! It never goes black, or smells and doesn't clog up the filters like the awful stuff we bought at a local Aquatic Centre.

It's been in for several weeks [early April'ish] and it's looking GOOD!!

Thanks to everyone who helped me out with this x.