Need help with hillstream!!

[janma]

This pic says more than any words.

As you can see the fish is covered in something white and stringlike. Haven't had any aditions in the tank in over 3 months. I caught this one, dont have any tank to keep it in, but dont think it will survive the night. It had no fighting left when caught. Im devastated, love my Gastromyzons.

[Martin Thoene]

Janne, that fish looks really skinny. I'm thinking that you're right about it not living long. The white stuff kind of looks like the slime coat lifting or something.

Do any of the others look like this? Or are they of similar shape? If so, it's quite probable that they have some internal parasite problem so you'll need to treat with Levamisole or something similar.

Compare this Sewellia from the same angle. Notice the shape of the body in the area of the dorsal fin. Your fish is quite pinched in there.



On yours, I can also see space between the pectoral and pelvic fins. In a normal fish there should be no visible gap.

Martin.

[shari2]

Janma, I'm sorry I can't help.

I had a group all die off from the same type of thing. Started with lethargy and not eating, moved on to the greyish slime coat problems and within a day they were all gone (6 of them). I nearly gave up on my hillstream tank. Had to leave it empty for a good month before I tried again. Couldn't discern what the problem was and didn't want to kill any more fish.

Tried antibiotics (kanacyn), metronidazole, and rid ich even though I knew it wasn't ich. They all passed on anyway.

The tank was empty of fish for over a month before I started again with neon cherry barbs. After I added them there was a terrible green water outbreak which started to clear after another month. Finally got up the nerve to add two hillstreams and they are fine.



still slightly green but getting clearer every day. Took a long time.

[mikev]

Janne,

Sorry for the problem -- losing fish that you believe to be established is pretty painful.

No real help from me either: the possibilities are many and IME with Gastros it is nearly certain that once an animal gets lethargic it is not going to make it.

Some speculation about the cause: usually slime coat disintegrates after the death. Disintegration prior to death may be caused by a secondary infection, very likely when an animal is a very bad shape to start with. Such a secondary infection in most cases will not spread to other *healthy* fish, but a UV will be of help to lessen the chances of this happening.

As to the primary cause: this may or may not be a parasite. This can be found out by doing a necropsy. My feeling it is not: small loaches tend to die from parasites faster than develop a "skinny disease"; I've seen a number of hillstreams dead from parasites and none of them appeared emaciated. OTOH, I did see such a skinny gastro: last summer, a G.Ocellatus that survived BHS never fully recovered, never actively ate, and starved to death in about three months. It looked VERY skinny for a couple of weeks prior to death.

Do you happen to remember if this animal actually actively ate? If the answer is yes, deworming is a priority. If no, it is still a good idea, just in case.

[janma]

Yes its very skinny. No other hillstream look like that in the tank now. I have lost some earlier, all got very skinny but they didnt have the white on them. I´ve had no problems with the Sewelia in the same tank but the Gastromyzons body count goes up, this really sucks. I've speculated that it is some parasite that they get for feeding on the bottom, meaning that there is some in the sand. Thought about covering all the sand with flat stones.

It was still alive this morning and I think it ate some last night and gave it some food when leaving for work this morning. Still I think this is a battle me and my little buddy will loose.

[mikev]

The little guy is a fighter

If it is a parasite, the external symptoms are likely secondary. When an animal is weakened it can be attacked by all kinds of pathogens, for example, I've seen true fungi secondary infections emerging and some other "interesting" things.

Now, a couple of tidbits of my experiences with parasites (worms): Gastros do appear to be more vulnerable than other hillstreams...probably has to do with their eating habits and smaller size. It does not mean that other species are safe, it just takes longer. F.e. I saw a pattern of six Gastro deaths in one tank and no deaths among other species.

The very best thing you can do is to try to locate someone who can figure out what you are dealing with exactly. If the animal dies, necropsy often provides the answers. If the animal pulls through, poop can be examined. In my last encounter, I was unable to stop the dying until a professional looked at a dead Gastro and identified the problem. See if there is a vet that deals with fish around.

What is the sequence of dying exactly? If you had a few deaths at the beginning, and then 3 months of quiet, a worm is less likely. If you had continuing deaths, say every one/two weeks, a worm is quite possible.

Now, if the slime coat problem is the primary infection (imho unlikely, but who knows?), and if it is bacterial, furan2 is the best med to deal with such problems. Since it is pretty much biofilter-safe and non-toxic to fish, it is something that can be tried. If this med is not available, anything based on furandazole can be tried, e.g. Furanese.

hth & good luck!

[janma]

There might be hope yet. We're still alive here. I got someting called Sera omnipur, which is a multipurpose medicine for freshwater fish. Don't have any tanks left so the fish is in a 10L bucket with an aquaball-filter. Started the treatment friday and it will take another 5 days for it to finish.

There was no info how the shrimp would react to the medicin so that why I wouldnt put in the tank. So to test it I put some Red Cherrys in the bucket too and they are alive, good to know. It also makes the water green (it has malachite green in it).

But anyhow's I'll report back later in the week how things went, I'm alot more confident now that this could end well.

[janma]

Last night the great white porcelain god took the loach on it's final journey. The meds didn't work or were applied too late. Well life sucks and then you die, even for small loaches.