Sick fish- need help

[Whitey_MacLeod]

I noticed recently that some of my cheni have a few white tubercules around the mouth area. I've been keeping a close eye on them for the last few days trying to figure out what's wrong, and I've got no idea. They're all still fully active, eating well and even spawning, but there's a few other signs I'm not sure about, and today I found a sick white cloud as well.
Apart from the white tubercules, I've noticed that some of my cheni have paler areas around the base of the dorsal and caudal fins, and a white edge to the dorsal fin. I'm not sure if these signs are all connected, or just something I've not noticed in a few of my fish before. Some don't show any of these signs.

No other fish have show any signs of illness at all until I spotted the white cloud today, which is breathing fast, struggling to swim and has a large bulge on one side of it's body. It's sat in the bottom of a breeder net at ther moment, and doesn't look like it's going to make it

Photos:



















i'm about to do water tests- I'll post the results as soon as I'm done.
I've got no idea what this could be, or even if the cheni and white cloud are suffering from the same thing. Any advice would be much appreciated.

[Whitey_MacLeod]

Nitrate 10
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0
GH 2
KH <1
pH 6.8
Phosphate 1.0-2.5 (It's somewhere in between colours on the test)

Nothing out of te ordinary here. The phosphates are high, but they're high out of the tap, and never been a problem yet

Tap water test results:

[Diana]

Could the WCM be gravid? Eggs sometimes will be odd-lumpy, not quite symetrical. My females seem to stay quite active, though.
Other possibility is a tumor (significantly irregular or lopsided)
Internal parasites can give them a 'pot bellied' look, but this is usually symetrical.

[Jim Powers]

White tubercules are normal on healthy spawning cheni.
As for the white cloud, I have seen this before in white clouds. I always thought it was an internal bacterial infection.

[shari2]

Is the white cloud still with you? That bulge is also reddened from what I can see. Camallanus worms will present with a bulge like that before you see the worms protruding. But you would have a bunch of fish with worms shortly thereafter, so i don't think that's it.

Infection, tumor, hemmorrhage? Can't really say. She does look chubby, but the swelling/redness is a bit high and too localized for impacted eggs. If you are really into it, and she passes on, you could resect the red area and investigate.

[mikev]

Worms are very unlikely to get to white clouds first when there are hillstreams around...they catch them much faster.

Some kind of infection, or possibly even blockage, with good chances that it is not going to spread to other fish, and no obvious way to treat...and it may recover on itself too (I've seen similar with rasbora's and wc's).

[Whitey_MacLeod]

Cheers everyone. I'm glad to hear the white tubercules are normal anyway. I wasn't sure if my cheni were sick or not, but it seemed more likely once I spotted the white cloud.

I've moved the white cloud into a quarantine tank now for treatment- she's still got a chance I think.
The white cloud is gravid, which is adding to her size, but this bulge just isn't in the right place. It's difficult to get a photo that shows it well, but she's definitely the wrong shape.
Yeah, the bulge is reddened, with a little bit of purple today. Redness extends around to the other side as well.
There's been no new fish or plants added to the tank for several months, so no possible sources for infection. To be honest, I'm stumped. I've seen bacterial infections in white clouds before which looked very similar, but without the very loacalised swelling or purple tinge.
Internal injuries maybe? Do fish bruise like people?

[Diana]

Yes, fish can show bruises like people.
You are right, the new shots sure are not typical of an egg-filled fish. Something else is going on there.
For constipation, try Daphnia. (Insect eating fish are not too likely to be interested in peas)

[Whitey_MacLeod]

Well, she didn't make it
I cut into her and found a load of yellow fluid. No visible sign of any parasites at least. I'm no expert, but from what I've seen I'd say bacterial infection looks likely, with a tumour being a possibility.