dwarf botia missing eye

[mrsleny]

Hi there,

I am new to fishkeeping (actually mr leny is fishkeeper and I am fishwatcher). We have a 30 gallon tank set up for 4 months with water temperature around 24C. Water parameters = nitrate (20), nitrite (0), pH (7.5). Substrate is fine sand.

Inhabitants include:
* 1 fancy guppy
* 1 pangio oblonga (black kuhli loach)
* 4 pangio kuhli (kuhli loach)
* 3 botia histronica (zebra botia)
* 2 Chinese algae eaters
* 9 harlequin rasboras
* 5 yasuhikotakia sidthimunki (started with 6)
* several ghost shrimp
* various plants

This morning (10:30) I discovered one of the dwarf botia had died and several of the kuhlis and zebra botias swimming around like crazy. They seemed to have calmed down after removal of the dead dwarf botia. WHen I looked in my tank this evening (00:12), I saw another dwarf botia lying on the sand. I thought he was dead until I saw him move around a bit. Then I noticed he seemed to be missing an eye. He is just staying along the bottom and not swimming as much as his tankmates.

I am worried that one of the zebras or kuhlis might be responsible for the missing eye. Is this possible? They are all very active but not aggressive as far as I can tell. Could he have snared the spine under his eye on a plant? Will he be okay with just one eye?

I don't know if the first dwarf botia death had anything to do with the other dwarf botia missing an eye. This coincidence worries me. I'd be grateful for any advice.

thanks kindly.

[starsplitter7]

I am so sorry to hear what is happening with your fish.

What is your ammonia reading? If you do not have the kit, have a store test it to make sure that reading is 0.

It is definitely not your Kuhlies and probably not your zebra or histrionica fish who have injured your Sids. (Sids are generally more rambunctious than either of those species). The most likely culprit is the Chinese algae eaters -- if they are the fish commonly sold as Chinese Algae eaters. Not only do they not eat algae (they are also not from China), they are extremely aggressive as they age. You need to return them to the LFS and get a trio of Otocats to work on the algae. If the tank is only four months old, is there any algae? If there isn't any algae don't worry about an algae eater yet. Don't get just one Oto. They like to be in a group, the bigger the better.

I would put the Sid (Dwarf loach) in a quarantine tank. (Ideally you should always have a quarantine tank for new fish and for sick fish.) If you don't have one, put him in a breeder box sold for live bearers -- keep it very clean rinsing it with tank water several times a day, add some floating plants, so your fish doesn't feel exposed, . . . He needs to be separated from the other fish, so he can heal. One eyed fish and blind fish do fine, if they get enough to eat and heal without getting an infection.

As a side note: Make sure you feed your algae eaters. People sometimes think they get enough to eat from algae in the tank, and so they starve to death. Depending on the species algae wafers, zucchini, cucumber and shrimp pellets work well.

I would even consider moving the chinese algae eaters to a bucket with a filter or bubble for the night, and return them to the store tomorrow. (Some people just flush them, but that isn't the right thing to do. For the right tanks they can be good inhabitants, and when they grow up they are beautiful, interesting fish. It isn't their fault most stores do not know anything about the fish they sell.)

Do you have lots of decorations and hiding places for the fish? Good luck and get that injured fish protected.

[mrsleny]

Thank you so much for your advice. Hopefully we can remove the injured Sid without further damage or stress. They are very quick.

As for algae we did have some on the little "huts" we moved over from our smaller tank. The Chinese algae eaters are getting bigger and are fed wafers. They never seemed to bother the other loaches. And I read usually flatish fish are in danger from them. I thought the Sids would be too fast for them.

Your advice is greatly appreciated. Hope the little guy makes it.

[starsplitter7]

I just hope it helps. Hopefully another member will come along who has more experience than I do. Generally I keep injured fish really clean and low stress. I have Sids too. I know how quick and clever they can be. Chinese algae eaters are also very fast.

I do the same thing. When there's too much algae in one tank, I move the stuff to the tank with my major algae eaters. It is clean by morning. Today I had an old piece of equipment filled with snail eggs. I put it in my loach/cory tank, and it was spotless in half an hour. Easier than trying to clean it.

Algae eaters can also be a danger to fish with the same body shape. They do not take kindly to others, especially the same species, "sharks" and "loaches".

Here's a funny and enlightening article on Chine Algae Eaters.
http://aqualandpetsplus.com/Oddball,%20 ... 0Eater.htm

[starsplitter7]

And just think. I like Chinese Algae Eaters. I was thinking about a single in its own tank.

I used to work in a fish store, and I wanted to label them Non Chinese, non algae Eaters.

[mrsleny]

Both Chinese algae eaters have been removed. They are going to someone with a much bigger tank and much bigger fish. The little Sid is still hanging around so there's hope. We're going to try to isolate him later.

The LFS had labeled the algae eaters as Thai Algae Eaters so we thought we were getting a different fish. Lesson learned the hard way. Now I wonder if they killed the flower shrimp as well.

THANK YOU!

[starsplitter7]

I am happy to hear that the Chinese Algae Eaters are going to a good home. I do think they are neat fish and deserve good treatment/homes. Could it be that the Thai AE is a different fish, or did you confirm it is a CAE?

I bought CAEs for years thinking they were intended to keep my small tanks clean of algae. They died, because they can't handle small tanks. I felt bad. Did a bunch of research. Little Otos work much better. I try to keep 5-10 all the time. And I am a fan of snails, but my tanks are acidic.

I wouldn't be too quick to blame the CEA for the flower shrimp. I currently have a trio, but I find them very tempermental. If I manage to keep them a few months, I can keep them over a year. I lose them if the temp in the house drops. I also wouldn't put it past a loach to bother a shrimp, even a big shrimp. The Flower shrimp can also be difficult to feed. I put fry food in the water column for them. I think they are really wonderful. I keep mine with guppies and very young Bristlenoses.

[mrsleny]

I am pretty sure the algae eaters were mislabelled at my LFS. They have big suckermouths and the colouring looks about right for CAEs. We will definitely buy otocats if we have a serious algae problem in future. I love snails myself but they would not survive the zebra loaches. I have a separate 10 gallon with one assassin snail, one pregnant ghost shrimp and a bunch of baby ghost shrimp. We couldn't find the assassin for months and we were going to decommission the tank but one day he just reappeared crawling up the glass! Now it has become my invert tank. I'd love to add some other shrimp in future.

We still have 2 flower shrimp in the 30 gallon and they seem to be doing okay. They hide out in the little "hut" quite a lot. mrleny crushes fish flakes and puts them into the water stream for them. I have read they are difficult to feed. I did wonder whether if the one that died may not have gotten enough food. I haven't seen the loaches bother them so far. The loaches seem to leave the ghost shrimp alone as well.

As for my one-eyed sid, he was too difficult to catch so we're leaving him alone for the time being. He has perked up a lot and is zipping around the tank. mrleny thinks his eye is starting to heal over. All the loaches seem happier without the CAEs.

Thanks again for the great advice!

[starsplitter7]

I am happy to hear your Sid appears to be recovering. Just keep an eye on him and make sure he is eating. He will adjust to the loss of the eye as long as it is kept clean and gets enough to eat. Fish can be pretty vicious and seem to go for eyes first on compromised fish. I am happy you were able to rehome the CAE.

I love snails too and keep them out of my loach tanks. I have a hard time keeping the water hard enough for snails.

The Otos would be a great addition to your tank, and they graze on all the tank, decore, plants (but don't eat the plants, just stuff on the plants) and they are incredibly cute. I keep them in large groups because they are social fish. When they catch them in the wild, they will nets hundreds at a time.

Lately I have been feeding the bamboo shrimp fry food, and that seems to be working. My large Bamboo shrimp lives in a coconut hut with a small BN. Sometimes one of the little Bamboos will hang out in there too. They seem to get along pretty well.